Mostly related to not being used to 10+tf. You need a feeling where your Tori will stop moving after your turn and if you don't play regularly at those turnframes. At least I have that problem regularly when I didn't play in forever or have just been making replays. I'm trained to always give 100% possible power because I can finetune movements. In MP aim>power. It just takes some getting used to it.


Probably, but is it required to be the best in MP? I wouldn't consider the more graceful person the better player in general. If one was to float neatly into my raging kick instead of blocking/dodging it I wouldn't think of that person as super awesome. Being graceful might count for spars but for most mods it's about who plays best within the set rules and overpowers the opponent.


If people use infinite reaction time now doesn't that mean MP isn't a matter of restricted time though. And congrats, so do awesome replaymakers. We don't sit there editing after every 10 frames. Stuff would never get finished that way.

Generally SP is a lot more error sensitive than MP because the stuff you try to pull off is a lot extremer. In Aikido I supplex my opponent. I don't care where or how. If I fail I just do something else to get him dq'ed. In TK I do some blocking and thrust my leg up his ass, if I have a nice grab I might go in for a punch instead. Hell I don't know what I'll do next turn. I don't have to 5 dm boom him to be considered better. Outdoing him is enough.

Generally this question is an easy one. To be the best in MP you have to beat other players. To be the best in SP you have to beat the physics.

It's easier to become better than others in MP by playing regularly and figuring out good strategys than go in SP and make a 7dm nograb punch. And unless you do that, you are not the best. And that's likely not a matter of time. You won't do it.

I meant to say not all of you but most i think. At least what i have seen(i'm not 100% sure did they even play for real or did they just mess around)

single player you are given an infinite amount of time to create a replay. given an finite amount of time nothing is impressive. multiplayer you are given 20 seconds to perform the actions you want.you also need to worry about the opponents actions, how they may effect your own and how to deal with them, all within the time limit. the act of overcoming this limitation to perform the outcome you want is what makes it more skillfull.

multiplayer has more limitations to overcome to achieve the result you want, therefore it is more skillfull.

So basically, Oblivion's selfspar, tricking, Jaker's bboying, Nuthug's headpasses, and all those legendary replays are nothing impressive?

Idk it sounds like excuse

to me , no.

how much more impressive would it have been if they accomplished that with the limitations multiplayer brings?

You don't have an INFINITE amount of time. Unless you want to post your replay in 30 years when it's irrelevant. I don't know about other replay makers but normally I finish a replay within a day. This excludes big projects like hacking, supercrazy stuff, etc.
SaintD is probably (one of) the best Aikido players and he always uses the same opener (mirrored sometimes). At some point you are simply used to all scenarios and you have a rough idea how to react to them. Sure there always slight variations and sometimes close and thrilling stuff and we all love these moments. I know you are awesome at MP and I know that you know this. You develop a rough gameplan, stances for comebacks, counterattacks and whatnot. You are rarely faced with new challenges and if you do you probably know how to react to them. The stuff you try to do isn't frameperfect or relies on every joint to be set perfectly. That would be too risky.

In SP you look for these things. People are constantly pushing the limits of the physics. That's why you NEED more time. And by trial and error you might pull something of given an infinite amount of time. Of course, if you think you can become the best replay maker by spending an infinite amount of time on one replay then MP is probably more skillful. Replay making is like being in the charts. There are one hit wonders but they will never be considered the best unless they pull off crazy stuff constantly over a long period of time. Opponents get better, too but in my opinion it's easier to adapt to new strategies than constantly redefine the boundaries of the game.

you are talking about mp in fight focused context, but mp is not ONLY about fights, which you like to ignore for 2nd or 3rd time, and make a stand like sp is something absolutely different, which it is not.

mp is not ONLY about fight. this is the statement. no need to bring fight situations now. it's irrelevant. you did this twice already and we are not talking about it. no need to try to bring it up again.

if you want a crystal clear example or what we are talking about - here, again:

mp spar / parkour
vs
sp spar / parkour

i will replhrase my previous statement into a very simple question:

we take two parkour replays, which are absolutely identical,
the only difference is that one is made in sp, another in mp with normal reaction time.

question is rhetorical, here it is:
is the player who created this awesome replay in mp within limited time to make a move, one try and with no ability to change anything objectively better that the one who spent a day making (absolutely identical by chance) replay being able to rewind it and edit it any time he wants?

this is what we are talking in a nutshell.

to sum it up, again, objectively:
the only difference between mp and sp is that in mp you are limited by time and one try.
in sp you are not.

no need to bring fight, strategies and other bs in, you will be talking out of context again.
you did it already several times, no need to repeat yourself on something we are NOT talking about.

do you really think mp sparring and parkour compare to sp sparring and parkour in quality?

Sir, I'm afraid to tell you you are the person offtopic here. You can't just go around and ignore everything that doesn't suit your point of view.
This topic is about MP vs SP. And especially where it takes most skill to become the BEST and not where it is harder to perform the same thing.

When was this specifically condensed to MP spars vs SP spars anyway? I seem to have missed that.

You can do significantly worse stuff in MP than people do in SP (in terms of quality) and be the best in MP anyway. Sure you have the restriction and it's harder to do the same thing but that has never been the point discussed here.

And seriously. The stuff people do in MP spars is rarely complex. There's often no reason why you'd need to edit anyway. And you said yourself that reactiontime is set so large it doesn't matter anymore.
Even in your definition of MP being a SP with one try I stick to SP. Since in SP you have to outperform other people who have 'infinite time and tries', too. Otherwise you won't be the best in SP.

can you expand on these points? what exactly is being redefined by sp players, how are the limits being pushed?

to me, modern replays aren't too distinct from replays in 2008. they've just got generally better in quality.