Original Post
Is There Such Thing As REAL Freedom
In Western society, we are all deemed as free people. But is this true?
Definition:
able to act or be done as one wishes; not under the control of another.
"I have no ambitions other than to have a happy life and be free"
In SOME sense we are "free". But in my opinion, its not REAL freedom. Yes we have the right to vote, to choose whether we go to Uni/College or not. But all of these things come under rules.
Rules: "exercise ultimate power or authority over an area and its people"
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I believe that it is almost impossible for humans to live in a community and be free, as humans are naturally competitive; for power, knowledge,
fame, wealth, popularity of the hundreds. This is also why the great idea of communism doesn't work, its just a dream.
That is not to say that none of this is possible. Keep in mind, this is coming from a 13 year olds point of view. School is a great example of Fake freedom. At school, you are taught what you are taught to believe and think, as at a young age, you see the teacher as an icon of knowledge, and that "teachers are right" as my little brother says.
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Kids Rights:
Yes, Kids are new to the world and have little experience. But they do have a large creative imagination that most adults don't as their thoughts and beliefs haven't been guided in to that mind set yet. And their minds are malleable, and easy to mould into who they are today
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As i said, i am 13, and i may be incorrect, or i could be coming a cross from the wrong direction, but please dont give me a hard time about it
p.s im not good at setting up a thread sorry
------
Cheers!
Hontas
Definition:
able to act or be done as one wishes; not under the control of another.
"I have no ambitions other than to have a happy life and be free"
In SOME sense we are "free". But in my opinion, its not REAL freedom. Yes we have the right to vote, to choose whether we go to Uni/College or not. But all of these things come under rules.
Rules: "exercise ultimate power or authority over an area and its people"
__________________________________________________ _____________
I believe that it is almost impossible for humans to live in a community and be free, as humans are naturally competitive; for power, knowledge,
fame, wealth, popularity of the hundreds. This is also why the great idea of communism doesn't work, its just a dream.
That is not to say that none of this is possible. Keep in mind, this is coming from a 13 year olds point of view. School is a great example of Fake freedom. At school, you are taught what you are taught to believe and think, as at a young age, you see the teacher as an icon of knowledge, and that "teachers are right" as my little brother says.
_______________
Kids Rights:
Yes, Kids are new to the world and have little experience. But they do have a large creative imagination that most adults don't as their thoughts and beliefs haven't been guided in to that mind set yet. And their minds are malleable, and easy to mould into who they are today
_____________
As i said, i am 13, and i may be incorrect, or i could be coming a cross from the wrong direction, but please dont give me a hard time about it
p.s im not good at setting up a thread sorry
------
Cheers!
Hontas
Last edited by Hontas; Apr 8, 2016 at 04:24 AM.
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You are approaching freedom from an extremely narrow viewpoint but I guess I'll answer the question in your terms, practically, not taking the philosophical question of "free will" into consideration.
You are in theory "free" to kill a man, rape some babies, stop going to school and eat pudding for breakfast, dinner and evening snack. The only thing is, you will have to face the consequences. What you are thinking of as "freedom" is basically anarchy, which some think is the right way to go.
But would this kind of freedom be good? I doubt you think it would be.
In a society such as yours/ours, we give away certain freedoms in order to prevent certain actions being taken agaisnt us, like for example some of the ones mentioned above. We have realized that "forcing" kids to go to school is beneficial for all of us and thus we "infringe" on peoples freedoms. Sure, we are not absolutely free in the eyes of the law or in our society, but that's not necessarely a bad thing. I certainly am willing to give a way few freedoms in order to not get shot at.
The question of how much freedom should we take away from people is an interesting and an evolving discussion, some countries choose differently. Some societies organize around very strict codes of conduct while others try to keep freedom to the maximum amount possible. What you think is the right way is up to you.
In a nutshell: No, you are not completely free in our society and thats probably a good thing.
You are in theory "free" to kill a man, rape some babies, stop going to school and eat pudding for breakfast, dinner and evening snack. The only thing is, you will have to face the consequences. What you are thinking of as "freedom" is basically anarchy, which some think is the right way to go.
But would this kind of freedom be good? I doubt you think it would be.
In a society such as yours/ours, we give away certain freedoms in order to prevent certain actions being taken agaisnt us, like for example some of the ones mentioned above. We have realized that "forcing" kids to go to school is beneficial for all of us and thus we "infringe" on peoples freedoms. Sure, we are not absolutely free in the eyes of the law or in our society, but that's not necessarely a bad thing. I certainly am willing to give a way few freedoms in order to not get shot at.
The question of how much freedom should we take away from people is an interesting and an evolving discussion, some countries choose differently. Some societies organize around very strict codes of conduct while others try to keep freedom to the maximum amount possible. What you think is the right way is up to you.
In a nutshell: No, you are not completely free in our society and thats probably a good thing.
Last edited by cowmeat; Apr 8, 2016 at 04:45 AM.
Originally Posted by cowmeat
You are approaching freedom from an extremely narrow viewpoint but I guess I'll answer the question in your terms, practically, not taking the philosophical question of "free will" into consideration.
You are in theory "free" to kill a man, rape some babies, stop going to school and eat pudding for breakfast, dinner and evening snack. The only thing is, you will have to face the consequences. What you are thinking of as "freedom" is basically anarchy, which some think is the right way to go.
But would this kind of freedom be good? I doubt you think it would be.
In a society such as yours/ours, we give away certain freedoms in order to prevent certain actions being taken agaisnt us, like for example some of the ones mentioned above. We have realized that "forcing" kids to go to school is beneficial for all of us and thus we "infringe" on peoples freedoms. Sure, we are not absolutely free in the eyes of the law or in our society, but that's not necessarely a bad thing. I certainly am willing to give a way few freedoms in order to not get shot at.
The question of how much freedom should we take away from people is an interesting and an evolving discussion, some countries choose differently. Some societies organize around very strict codes of conduct while others try to keep freedom to the maximum amount possible. What you think is the right way is up to you.
In a nutshell: No, you are not completely free in our society and thats probably a good thing.
Just a comment to say that what you wrote is very well written.
This in a sense, is "freedom" to me.
Not freedom in the animalistic sense, but that of a freedom of safety in society. To infringe on the certain freedoms such as "shoot your gun at another" allows other people to enjoy their freedom much better. Feel free to seek an education, feel free to be passionate about something etc.
Freedom is quite a subjective term depending in which way you mean it, anarchy is a form of freedom I would consider barbaric and we wouldn't be able to enjoy our lives free of diseases and live safely if not for our current society.
Oh boy cowmeat, free will and determinism is a whole other can of worms that we probably shouldn't open here. I think there's a preexisting thread about that, actually.
If you extrapolated a lot of abstract freedoms, like "the freedom to not get shot" or "the freedom to topple anything in your path" or "the freedom to not be influence by society" you could say that being completely free is absolutely impossible in a world where a bunch of roughly equal beings exist. I think the only thing that could ever claim absolute freedom is some sort of transient being.
Even without extrapolating those freedoms, the way our society is set up does remove some of our freedoms from us without great hindrance and/or consequence.
If you extrapolated a lot of abstract freedoms, like "the freedom to not get shot" or "the freedom to topple anything in your path" or "the freedom to not be influence by society" you could say that being completely free is absolutely impossible in a world where a bunch of roughly equal beings exist. I think the only thing that could ever claim absolute freedom is some sort of transient being.
Even without extrapolating those freedoms, the way our society is set up does remove some of our freedoms from us without great hindrance and/or consequence.
Originally Posted by pouffywall
Oh boy cowmeat, free will and determinism is a whole other can of worms that we probably shouldn't open here.
Thats why I did not open that discussion here, "not taking the philosophical question of "free will" into consideration.".
I think a discussion about what the freedoms in our society should be is a more meaningfull conversation to be had in this context.
