Originally Posted by Twilight
On the topic of the Trinity Force...
All those stats that hardly do anything you mean? I just don't see the point of a "jack of all trades, master of none" item because then, sure, you'll have a ton of stats but you'll never be incredibly powerful because there's not that much going on. It's like saying a Doran's Blade is a great late-game item.
No, you're comparing apples and oranges because you're mixing up two different concepts.
Gold efficiency means that for the amount of gold you put in, the stats you receive are greater than the average value of those stats converted into gold value.
Slot efficiency means that for the slot that the item takes up, it provides a greater amount of stats and utility than it could be provided with another item.
You're looking at the stats and ignoring the passives. Nobody upgrades items for solely the stat increases, they upgrade for the passives that late game items provide. Without it's passive, IE would be a waste to build because it's not gold efficient. TF is already gold efficient, and it's slot efficient because it provides the two strong passives of two component items, adds additional stats and buffs the passives further, then compresses all of them into one item.
To best explain this, there is a point where there is stat redundancy. Yasuo is an easy champion to help show this. Because of his passive, assuming 5% crit runes, Yasuo can max out crit chance with a statik shiv and an ie. Any further purchases into crit chance are not slot efficient, and not gold efficient, because you're wasting gold on stats that cannot be further increased or do not scale as well as you expend more money into the stat. Likewise, attack speed reaches redundancy on an adc when you can no longer effectively kite without wasting your extra attack speed. This forces you to remain stationary for maximum usage, which is a death sentence. Hence why past certain attack speed values, any further purchases are no longer gold efficient, and probably not slot efficient.
Hence why TF has great slot efficiency. It has passives which are hard, if not impossible ignoring outright stupidity, to interfere with slot or item efficiency, and it provides a great well rounding of stats that you can then supplement with more specialized items. The end result has less waste and more slot efficiency because every item is using it's full potential and it supplements in several fields as well.
nyan :3
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I get that it has good slot efficiency but it's not always a viable choice due to the relatively weak stats and decent passives. That's all I'm saying. Just one thing to bring into consideration though, if TF is so gold-efficient, then why is it not used in a majority of builds for most champions? All of the builds that I have gotten from either Mobafire or LoLKing for Annie, Ashe, Diana, Aatrox and my other champions have never even mentioned use of a TF.
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Originally Posted by Twilight
I get that it has good slot efficiency but it's not always a viable choice due to the relatively weak stats and decent passives. That's all I'm saying. Just one thing to bring into consideration though, if TF is so gold-efficient, then why is it not used in a majority of builds for most champions? All of the builds that I have gotten from either Mobafire or LoLKing for Annie, Ashe, Diana, Aatrox and my other champions have never even mentioned use of a TF.
wow you cant read or what...
Originally Posted by leyz
i mean i understand that he was trying to say that trinity force doesn't scale deep in any single direction like a lot of other big items do, but at the same time if you're talking about trinity on ezreal or lucian, it's a whole diferent thing because granted that you're gonna utilize the item's passive, it scales like stupid with those champions. as well as it's one of the better items when you wanna deal damage on champions that don't deal a lot of damage, which is mostly tanks(pls not lee sin).
also i love it how you "judge" an item's efficiency by whether or not someone uses it in a MOBAFIRE guide, lol.
"i think sunfire cape is a pretty bad item because i've never seen a competitive ad carry build it on caitlyn or vayne"
Last edited by leyz; Feb 28, 2014 at 04:06 AM.
Two of the people you mentioned are ap, while tf is an ad item. Ashe CAN use trinity force, and to great effect. Aatrox doesn't have the same effects of using it, but he can certainly run it as he benefits from the increased mobility it provides, and the extra burst from the procs don't hurt him at all.
I'll keep saying it as long as you don't read it.
Stats don't mean everything.
Effective stats are what matter when looking at stats.
Past a certain point, stat gains are not as effective, and therefore the number you see on the item is not the actual worth you are getting from buying the item. Simplest examples are buying items that would increase your cooldown reduction above 40%, or crit chance over 100% etc. etc.
Trinity force will almost never push stats beyond their effective value, while still providing a very solid all around versatility, and a very, VERY, large power spike because of the passive spell blade.
Please don't make me be an asshole again to try to make this point any simpler. I can really only go to diagrams to make this simpler, and that would still involve math.
I'll keep saying it as long as you don't read it.
Stats don't mean everything.
Effective stats are what matter when looking at stats.
Past a certain point, stat gains are not as effective, and therefore the number you see on the item is not the actual worth you are getting from buying the item. Simplest examples are buying items that would increase your cooldown reduction above 40%, or crit chance over 100% etc. etc.
Trinity force will almost never push stats beyond their effective value, while still providing a very solid all around versatility, and a very, VERY, large power spike because of the passive spell blade.
Please don't make me be an asshole again to try to make this point any simpler. I can really only go to diagrams to make this simpler, and that would still involve math.
nyan :3
Youtube Channel i sometimes post videos of other games
Youtube Channel i sometimes post videos of other games
Originally Posted by Twilight
On the topic of the Trinity Force...
All those stats that hardly do anything you mean? I just don't see the point of a "jack of all trades, master of none" item because then, sure, you'll have a ton of stats but you'll never be incredibly powerful because there's not that much going on. It's like saying a Doran's Blade is a great late-game item.
It's not a jack of all trades. You can't build it on anybody.
Yes you will, because it is extremely efficient for the gold, and for the slot.
And that last comment..... sigh.
