HTOTM: FUSION
Anarchy is not necessarily a crime, it is a simple point of view, in that our governing body is unstable, Old, Corrupted or useless. The want for freedom is the same idea, we are all born to do as we please in life, but we are pressured to abide the 'common way of thinking'. We are told at a young age that to want something is selfish and bad. However that is just brainwashing.
Desire can lead to suffering. Sometimes the more you want things, the less you feel like you have. Parents telling us to do things which will fit in with society tends to shape society, it doesn't just work the other way around. A parent will tell a child off for shouting and stuff because it is annoying and this shapes societies view of shouting in public for no reason. We are being brainwashed out of convenience by normal people rather than to help us got into a society we disagree with. We often comply naturally without pressurisation in order to gain social advantages or simply because it is human nature. People who spend time together tend to become more like each other in terms of personality as they can pick up certain repetitive traits from their companion. This probably won't happen if the individuals are not so confident and outgoing (and less charismatic maybe) but it is still part of human nature to imitate others.

I am bit saying that humanity is evolved to be lead without freedom of their own, just that compliance isn't unnatural.
Good morning sweet princess
Originally Posted by protonitron View Post
So how oppressive (and freedom limiting) a system is can entirely depend on the attitudes of the individuals in the hands of the system rather than what the system does? Or do you mean that the system should change entirely to fit those within it so that it can work with all its members to allow them to do what they want to do?

That isn't one of the real problems with the system.

Originally Posted by protonitron View Post
But shouldn't people be allowed to think what others have told them and then infer these thoughts onto others? I assume that what they think started off as belonging to someone who did think for themselves and their purpose to carry the message to those who can critically analyse it themselves is subsequently important. Just because a thought being presented is not presented by the original thinker doesn't necessarily mean that it is any less relevant to any conversation. Or am I reading too far into your word choice?

I was talking about people that don't want to think for themselves.
I put that in brackets for a reason.

Originally Posted by protonitron View Post
I feel like the fact that ImmortalPig infers that he is arguing a view he does not hold himself and the fact that you say the arguments of people who just recycle other peoples thought/views rather than arguing their own are not relevant to the conversation contradict the fact that you think we should listen to ImmortalPig talking about thoughts he does not necessarily think are right himself.

This paragraph was a bit stupid.
You don't need to believe something to argue for it, ever heard of a lawyer?

Originally Posted by Oizys View Post
Anarchy is not necessarily a crime, it is a simple point of view, in that our governing body is unstable, Old, Corrupted or useless. The want for freedom is the same idea, we are all born to do as we please in life, but we are pressured to abide the 'common way of thinking'. We are told at a young age that to want something is selfish and bad. However that is just brainwashing.

Read some of the comments before you post and sound like a complete mongoloid.
Just imagine how all current governments can be traced back to anarchy. Eventually, some strongman emerges who forces his will on people.
I think the idea is that if people are anarchists then they wouldn't let that happen.
Good morning sweet princess
Originally Posted by raaage
So every government is "freedom-taking", and therefore oppressing.

Originally Posted by raaage
If you agree to something it isn't oppressing you.

So a government that people agree to isn't oppressive? Only two posts into calling everyone else stupid and you've already rhetorically pooped yourself.

By the way, that tired cliche of a dichotomy between freethinking individuals and the uneducated sheeple is not doing you any favors. There are plenty of people much brighter than you who advocate for a variety of political systems either in discord or accord with your particular view, and attaching a metric of intelligence to people's various favored political philosophy is, to put it in your words, "fucking stupid."

Originally Posted by ImmortalPig
I don't see any particular downside to anarchism. It's essentially just removing bureaucracy and overhead from the system.

It's pretty ridiculous to say there's no downside to a philosophy that advocates the entire removal of state apparatus. Invasions. Weak or nonexistent social programs. Economic monopolization and exploitation. Child labor. Unsanitary food. Absence of coordinated emergency response. No public education.
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Hey look more than two lines.
Originally Posted by Boredpayne View Post
It's pretty ridiculous to say there's no downside to a philosophy that advocates the entire removal of state apparatus. Invasions. Weak or nonexistent social programs. Economic monopolization and exploitation. Child labor. Unsanitary food. Absence of coordinated emergency response. No public education.

All of which are not inherent in statism, and non of which are exclusive from statelessness.
<Faint> the rules have been stated quite clearly 3 times now from high staff
Originally Posted by ImmortalPig
All of which are not inherent in statism, and non of which are exclusive from statelessness.

You meant to say none of which are exclusive from statism, and all of which are not inherent to anarchy.

Which is equally ridiculous. The point is that those are all issues that anarchy needs to address and generally fails to do. "There is no downside to anarchy" is a wildly radical and fringe position that not even its leading theorists would attempt to argue. You will need a great deal more than an empty non sequitur and handwaving to justify it.
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Hey look more than two lines.
Originally Posted by ImmortalPig View Post
I don't see any particular downside to anarchism.

Then actually research the topic and develop a bit of nuance about it. Do you really believe that anarchism is some magical, flawless political philosophy - that it has no downsides? No, of course not, that's just ridiculous. Since you recognise that, I think you should also recognise that it might be a good idea to research it a bit more before engaging in a debate about it.

Originally Posted by ImmortalPig View Post
FYI you don't have to agree with something to argue for it. This board doesn't function if every thread is a circle jerk...

Did I say you have to agree with something to argue for it? No. I asked if there's anyone that agreed with it, because I'm interested in their opinion.
Originally Posted by Boredpayne View Post
You meant to say none of which are exclusive from statism, and all of which are not inherent to anarchy.

Which is equally ridiculous. The point is that those are all issues that anarchy needs to address and generally fails to do. "There is no downside to anarchy" is a wildly radical and fringe position that not even its leading theorists would attempt to argue. You will need a great deal more than an empty non sequitur and handwaving to justify it.

There are no downsides unique to anarchy beyond the general problems faced by every political system (or the lack thereof in this case). Anarchy just trusts people to look after themselves, which can be problematic, but so can trusting a state to do things for you. I think that anarchism is an extreme and is therefore (as more of the posters have pointed out) really rather impractical, in the same way that complete dictatorship control is viewed illogical as a choice by many people (including myself at times). I feel like a bit of anarchism (although anarchism, if moderated or toned down would no longer be true anarchism) is a good thing, and the promoted ideology of anarchism in how we treat the state system (with scepticism and doubt) is one which can be useful and which more people need to take on.

I feel like the problem with anarchy is it's extremity, ok, state systems can be bad but what is the difference between a government and a leadership, if people form small groups someone is likely to take charge, and this is not always a bad thing. Anarchism needs to know exactly where the line is rather than just being blanket disapproval of leadership. Although scepticism of leaders is completely necessary at all levels to a degree because when people stop having doubt in their leader really nasty shit can happen because they stop thinking for themselves, not that individuals can't do terrible thing as well.

Thank you for reading.
Good morning sweet princess