Originally Posted by SmaBOOOOOOOris

Nah I think your points are also good and I didn't mean to undermind it. It's just that the way I feel about it, ever since Help Squad disappeared there doesn't seem to be any development towards making this game better for newer players. There've been improvements to ranked seasons which is great for everyone I guess, but other than that I feel like everything is focused towards people who are already deeply rooted in the community. I'm just trying to level the field a little and speak for the less experienced ones, as they probably won't participate in this thread.

I'll also use this as an opportunity to expand my point because I thought of things to add. I feel like once you're in the community and you join a clan or just find friends who also play the game, it's easy to stay entertained even if the events aren't great or the game doesn't have much more to offer. The issue in my eyes is that a lot of people quit before they get that far, and without the community Toribash is a pretty boring game if we're being honest. Thus we need to either find ways of including these people as early in their game experience as possible, OR implement more features into the game where community is no longer an essential part of geting the best experience from the game.

I don't have suggestions of how that should be done, but there's definitely a discussion to be had there.

And about that "looking up to people" dynamic, I think it works both ways. When there's too many experienced players and not a lot of new faces, the standard of what is considered a "good player" goes up, and people who are good at the game might not feel like they're good or will ever be good due to how many other good players are around them. Just looking at the previous ranked seasons, a lot of good players finished gold or even silver due the ranked lobbies being dominated by the absolute top of the game players. Not sure how true that was in the most recent couple seasons as I wasn't around, but that was definitely an issue before and you can see how that can demotivate people to play the game at all.


That's a good idea I think. Although my view is this: if you're going to display cool videos that might motivate people to learn some skills, follow it up with tutorials or at least introductions to those topics. Currently most Toribash tutorials are outdated, so maybe it would be cool to get some tutorials about those topics and also have them in that area.

In terms of implementation that should be quite easy to do. The harder thing though is figuring out how to lay it out and what side features to implement so that it's actually useful instead of just being a galery of videos.

Originally Posted by Love

-market system: a lot of the players like the game and really want to have TC to buy his dream set and his dream items, but those new changes just killed the market with those taxes and I'm 100% sure there is a lot of better ways to maintain the economy like bringing back forum user customization for TC back that would be a great way to sink more TC, take off the bountys for people with high streaks in-game and make more tourney rooms with a bigger variety of mods like it used to be (greykido, TK, wushu, mushu, abd, aikido, lenshu) and taking the TC login rewards or atleast lowering then while keeping the 1 shiai per week

Originally Posted by SmaBOOOOOOOris

I disagree, I think the market was dead way before that. What killed the market was seemingly random price fluctuation and re-releases of limited items, which made it very risky to market things without having the insider knowledge of upcoming price changes. It didn't help that sir essentially said they will keep doing it as they see fit for the foreseeable future which obviously doesn't strike a lot of confidence.

The rest of your points are really good and I agree.

Originally Posted by Love

in my opinion, toribash is always trying to make new players come but the learning curve of the game is simply too big if they don't have something that makes them grind the game, what are those things?

-toribash content creation: a lot of the older players that we see now playing started toribash watching videos of old legends of the game and saw them as a role models to grind the game and get better, or had the weekly concon videos that he looked forward to appear so he would make a replay or complete a challenge, and clearly this has been missing for a while when concon stopped with TB related videos, when lesduncan stopped with the toribash competitive videos and right now i think toribash should try to bring more content creators to make events, share they're content on toribash discord/instagram to get others into getting back/stay playing the game.


-player groups: toribash used to have a lot of organizations for the different player groups to gather, talk, learn, teach that made a lot of players make new friendships get better at something they liked like making replays, forging flames, or even people that share that live in the same country and share the same mother lenguage, and sometimes i look now and i don't se those orgs and i feel thats a big reason that a lot of players decide to migrate to other games and leave toribash.


-role model players: when i look how most of the new players often don't keep playing, i think its mainly because they don't have a lot of legends, good players that keep playing the game, i'm not saying that there is no good players, but most of the legendary replaymakers/duelers/flame forgers/artists left the game mostly because the staff don't really listen to what those players want as a change or what should be reverted, so getting in touch and making events with those legends, for example, would be great so the newer player would learn more about toribash history and how some players made so much impact.


-ingame and forum events: nowadays i see a lot of etourneys and hotseats that players join everyday and a lot of events that seem like more of the same. Making less in-game events would be better in my opinion since playing the same kind of event everyday its kinda tiring, so making it 3/4 times a week would be good enough. The forum events like the head texture of the month thingy should have a dif kind of prizes (instead of TC + shiai and item make it a custom item for the event specifically) and maybe entrance fees so more TC can be sinked and making less events but with a variety fo theme like one Flame forger event, bring back old events like replay cup


staff and moderation: if you ask most of the older players that still plays toribash they probably feel that the staff most of the time don't listen to then while doing the decision making that lead to changes that make the game unenjoyable for a lot of them, like the market changes made a lot of marketers drift away form the game and now we can't buy certain items in the market since not a lot of players put their items up to sale and shiai tokens are easy to obtain so people rather wait to buy a full pack that makes using the market less useful and less enjoyable, so most of the time it feels like that the staff is filled with players that doesn't really understand as much flames like the flame forgers, the market like the marketers make changes that doesn't make a lot of sense, so in my opinion bringing back the orgs would help the staff so they could talk with people that know more about certain aspects of the game to see how they should change or if changing X or Y would help

Originally Posted by SmaBOOOOOOOris

I disagree, I think the market was dead way before that. What killed the market was seemingly random price fluctuation and re-releases of limited items, which made it very risky to market things without having the insider knowledge of upcoming price changes. It didn't help that sir essentially said they will keep doing it as they see fit for the foreseeable future which obviously doesn't strike a lot of confidence.

The rest of your points are really good and I agree.

Originally Posted by Love

that happened because one of the things that the staff made that all the marketers disliked was restocking the 3d items with prices way lower, and just the fact that the games just gives you 1 shiai and about 3k of TC just for login in every day of the week and saying that the tax its to mange the prices seems just dumb
why would someone ver use the market since they have threads for buying and selling items w/o the tax or simply wait 4 weeks and buy a pack or a 3d for shiai
and with the new chion event made up to 15 shiais already
how these types of changes will help solve the problem of the market??

Originally Posted by Lucci

Market Statistics show that with the implementation of the new market system, the new market system has generated more transactions per capita, with less players. It does get a bit dicey when discussing price fluctuation. As a member of MS and a avid marketer myself, I do try and avoid causing unnecessary price fluctuation that would destabilize current pricing for items. But alas it cannot be always stopped. Take the 2048 head for example. It was exclusive with only 3 copies at launch. Now there are well over 15 iirc. But the price didn't deviate that much from where it was. Sure it did go down in price, but it stabilized to a healthy rate in the current market eco-system. I do share sentiments regarding random price fluctuations but do bear in mind, it is inevitable to an extent. Something is only worth as much as someone will pay for it after all.



The restock of the 3D items was something that I wasn't around for. However, the 1 Shiai Token + 3K for logging in is much more than what was given in the past. It is an incentive for players who are newer to stick around and explore the market and what it has to offer. Yes it is considerably low, but that is by design, as if you give, lets say, 10k and 3 ST per week for logging on, it would create a TC inflation in which where everything would drop in price, as if everyone has ample amounts of TC, then nobody has TC. That would be unhealthy for the current market, and would have an adverse affect.

Also to point out that, the current tax on market sales, while a bit steep, is pretty reasonable. If you market a lot, then purchasing the premium shop pass is a roughly 85K commitment for 3 months. I feel that is beyond reasonable. Yes it is a big commitment for most, but it is a logical way of balancing out who is rewarded in the new market system. And to clarify why someone would use the market to begin with, if someone is trying to sell bulk amount of items, the market would benefit them more than selling the traditional way. They can mass list the items and have them automated to send and pay out when items are sold. The other way of selling via the forums, while more popular, is a more daunting task, as it could take weeks to find someone depending on what you are trying to sell and how high of a demand there is for that item to be sold. Not to mention the maintenance required to keep checking up on that thread to see if you received any responses. I do feel this new market change is a step in the right direction but I am open to all feedback.

Originally Posted by Love

for me it doesn't make sense we make a tax to sink over over the market while people get up to 19 shiai in the event, what will happen will be that the market will shrink, people wont care about the market because they can simply play a few es events and buy a pack for free basically, there is no point of having a market tax and so many ez ways to get a shiai token. and giving newer players more money isn't making then play for longer, if we take the daily rewards and make then get back into playing tourneys and filling the rooms we will create better players that will stay for a longer, since this change of the market seems like u can't barely find any items from some non traditional colors like blossom for example, because less people are using it, i think some of the changes like the new interface and the new buying option are great, but the market tax seems dumb, since this formula of giving newer members more TC and shiai haven't been paying off, as a i said earlie: the learning curve of toribash is high and that's what makes people stop playing the game not the fact it was hard to get TC or items, if you give what was the reward of grinding the game for simply login in and playing a 50/50 mod in etourneys the newer players never gonna grind the game and the learning curve will make him quit